Zen Internet Support Forum

Well i had another update from zen and also from what i read earlier, and really i'm still not satisfied with the answer.

The large latency times you are seeing within our network is because of a transatlantic link. The best route we currently have advertised to us is going over our New York link to above.net. As this is the best route we have advertised to ourselves, there is nothing we can do to decrease latency to your server. All other routes we have are worse.
If this server is actually located within the Netherlands, then going over to North America is obviously going to affect things significantly. It may be worth speaking to your provider, and seeing if their ISP is advertising incorrect routes to their network.

I'm in contact with several people @ ProjectFrag (which are a multigaming server provider company) who i rent the servers from. These Servers are in one of the largest datacenters in europe and peers with .uk with gigabit lines which earlier this year have been upgraded.
So the issue has been raised with them (ProjectFrag), and they are also raising it with the ISP their side. Obviously this also effects anyone else on the Zen network to the same gaming service as well any other service in that datacenter.

I also find it strange that zen seem to have know control over the routing, and that it goes to NewYork and back into europe, is this then a cost saving exercise? cannot zen peer directly with ams-ix ?
 

I thought Zen was peered with AMS-IX. Here's one route there:

 9  leibniz-xe-2-0-0-0.te.zen.net.uk (62.3.80.42)  31.610 ms  30.745 ms  32.514 ms
10  gsr12012.lon.he.net (195.66.224.21)  32.389 ms  31.205 ms  31.770 ms
11  10gigabitethernet1-1.core1.ams1.he.net (72.52.92.82)  39.722 ms  38.834 ms  39.394 ms
12  ams-ix.sara.xs4all.net (195.69.144.48)  39.979 ms  38.562 ms  38.901 ms
(Interleaving is enabled on my connection, so these are higher than they need to be.)

And another:

 9  leibniz-xe-2-0-0-0.te.zen.net.uk (62.3.80.42)  32.841 ms  32.490 ms  31.759 ms
10  linx.rbi-lon.as34305.net (195.66.224.249)  38.243 ms  37.313 ms  37.418 ms
11  10ge-v2.core-2.ipv4-mg8.db-ams.euroaccess.nl (85.12.0.18)  37.276 ms  35.617 ms  36.684 ms

It's possible that Leaseweb (the ISP hosting ProjectFrag) have temporarily dropped their AMS-IX routes according to these reports:

http://noc.leaseweb.com/status.php?i=176
http://noc.leaseweb.com/status.php?i=209

DoZZa:

Like I said, I only really use the net for gaming, and at £34.99 a month, thats expensive,

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I would agree £34.99 is way too expensive for just gaming

Normal 0 false false false MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 Have you considered the service with the lower download allowance?

 

Doesn't help with your ping issue, but would be a quick way of saving £120 a year

 

 

 

 

Well for me its just a waiting game, zen did return a more technical explanation on why its the way it is, i have informed my gameserver provider with this latest detail, who in turn are on good terms with leaseweb and passed all info onto them as well. Hopefully this will get leaseweb and zen into contact to resolve this issue.

 If it dosn't look likely to get resolved than i will have to chance switching to another provider, which from the sound of it from other peeps from uk playing on our servers do not have the same problem.
 

Nefertem:

Well for me its just a waiting game, zen did return a more technical explanation on why its the way it is, i have informed my gameserver provider with this latest detail, who in turn are on good terms with leaseweb and passed all info onto them as well. Hopefully this will get leaseweb and zen into contact to resolve this issue.

 If it dosn't look likely to get resolved than i will have to chance switching to another provider, which from the sound of it from other peeps from uk playing on our servers do not have the same problem.
 

I would like to see that technical explanation if you have it.

i have also notice some spped issues these last 2 days or so, my router is syncing at about 7000 kbps and i usualy get about that, on speed tests now i'm only getting about 5000kbps.

 

here's some of the traces i'm getting too

 Tracing route to speedtester.bt.com [217.35.209.142]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    <1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  192.168.0.1
  2    33 ms    33 ms    33 ms  galileo-sub-lb.zen.net.uk [62.3.82.19]
  3    33 ms    32 ms    32 ms  lotze-ge-0-0-1-140.hq.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.141]
  4    34 ms    34 ms    33 ms  nietzsche-ae2-0.ls.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.70]
  5    33 ms    34 ms    33 ms  nozick-ae1-0.ls.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.74]
  6    40 ms    40 ms    44 ms  lorenz-so-0-1-0-0.te.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.78]
  7    39 ms    39 ms    40 ms  linx2.ukcore.bt.net [195.66.226.10]
  8    40 ms    41 ms    41 ms  core2-pos9-0-0.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net [194.74.6
5.125]
  9    47 ms    47 ms    46 ms  core2-pos9-0.manchester.ukcore.bt.net [62.6.204.
198]
 10    46 ms    47 ms    44 ms  vhsaccess1-pos8-0.manchester.fixed.bt.net [62.6.
196.202]
 11     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 12     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 13     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 14     *        *        *     Request timed out.

 Tracing route to zen.co.uk [82.71.140.243]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    <1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  192.168.0.1
  2    34 ms    34 ms    33 ms  galileo-sub-lb.zen.net.uk [62.3.82.19]
  3    36 ms    33 ms    32 ms  lotze-ge-0-0-1-140.hq.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.141]
  4    32 ms    33 ms    33 ms  spinoza-ae1-0.hq.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.65]
  5    34 ms    40 ms    33 ms  bolzano-ae2-0.wh.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.53]
  6    34 ms    33 ms    33 ms  cavendish-14-1-12.wh.zen.net.uk [62.3.83.101]
  7    33 ms    34 ms    32 ms  fw1.tc.net.hosting.zen.co.uk [82.71.206.251]
  8     *        *        *     Request timed out.
  9     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 10     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 11     *        *        *     Request timed out.

 

 

i'm also getting problems connecting to sites like hotmail/live/msn and also very slow connections to most other sites

Yes something weird going on, my speedtests today seem to be ok but browsing slow, last night download speeds were chronic getting about 3mbps where I usually get 6.5mbps

 tracert zen.co.uk

1     1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  192.168.0.1
  2    24 ms    23 ms    23 ms  gauthier-dsl1.hq.zen.net.uk [62.3.82.17]
  3    24 ms    22 ms    23 ms  lotze-ge-0-0-1-136.hq.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.137]
  4    23 ms    24 ms    25 ms  spinoza-ae1-0.hq.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.65]
  5    25 ms    24 ms    23 ms  bolzano-ae2-0.wh.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.53]
  6    23 ms    24 ms    23 ms  cavendish-14-1-12.wh.zen.net.uk [62.3.83.101]
  7    24 ms    24 ms    25 ms  fw1.tc.net.hosting.zen.co.uk [82.71.206.251]
  8     *        *        *     Request timed out.
  9     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 10     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 11     *        *        *     Request timed out.

 

Your DSL connection rate: 8128 kbps(DOWN-STREAM),  448 kbps(UP-STREAM)
    IP profile for your line is - 7150 kbps
    Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 4031 kbps

 

System Up Time 23:35:12

Port Status TxPkts RxPkts Collisions Tx B/s Rx B/s Up Time WAN PPPoA 355876 634266 0 1351 28410 08:25:11 LAN 10M/100M 1495759 817098 0 24448 996 23:35:04 WLAN 11M/54M 0 0 0 0 0 23:34:55

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream Connection Speed 8128 kbps 448 kbps Line Attenuation 16.0 db 9.0 db Noise Margin 11.8 db 19.0 db

raf:

Mine seems to be back to normal now dozza, hope yours is too.

I spoke to support and they said some work was done on some of the routers this morning which might've been the cause.

It looks like your issue could have been due to interleaving - which was set to 'auto' and had switched on.  Opting out of interleaving should prevent a reoccurance.  :)

regards,

Phil. 

---

--
Phil Long
Technical Support Manager - Zen Internet Ltd.

DoZZa:

to see that technical explanation if you have it.

Hi,

In brief terms, Abovenet peer with Zen in London and New York.  Leaseweb get connectivity from Abovenet and are telling Abovenet not to advertise all of Leaseweb's subnets to its peers in Europe. Therefore the best route to Leaseweb becomes the Abovenet peering in New York as all of Leaseweb's subnets are being advertised there. 

On the trip back to Zen the traffic is coming via London as we advertise that as the best route to our network. 

As Jerry mentioned earlier in this thread, unfortunately this is out of our hands and is down to a Leaseweb decision.

regards,
Phil. 

---

--
Phil Long
Technical Support Manager - Zen Internet Ltd.

Mine has always said fast then auto.I have looked it says since May interleaved then auto.Does this mean interleaving  has been turned on too after a year.I have noticed ping up slightly on ventrilo and games.

Another gamer having similar problems - high ping, and occasional packet loss causing disconnects from games, if i can actually get into them at the moment.  gaining access to some websites is similarly nightmarish atm (tiscali/msn to name but 2)

Pinging bbc.co.uk [212.58.224.131] with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 212.58.224.131: bytes=32 time=71ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.224.131: bytes=32 time=81ms TTL=120
Reply from 212.58.224.131: bytes=32 time=61ms TTL=120
Request timed out.

Ping statistics for 212.58.224.131:
    Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 3, Lost = 1 (25% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 61ms, Maximum = 81ms, Average = 71ms

 

Pinging zen.co.uk [82.71.140.243] with 32 bytes of data:

Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.

Ping statistics for 82.71.140.243:
    Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 0, Lost = 4 (100% loss),

Tracing route to bbc.co.uk [212.58.224.131]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1     1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  192.168.0.1
  2    59 ms    63 ms    64 ms  gay-dsl1.wh.zen.net.uk [62.3.83.20]
  3    70 ms    68 ms    64 ms  erazmus-ae-0-200.wh.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.201]
  4    76 ms    91 ms    75 ms  leibniz-so-0-1-0-0.te.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.45]
  5    79 ms    77 ms    70 ms  lorenz-xe-2-0-0-0.te.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.41]
  6    63 ms    65 ms    65 ms  82.71.254.134
  7    71 ms    73 ms    75 ms  212.58.238.129
  8    72 ms    70 ms    72 ms  rdirwww-vip.thdo.bbc.co.uk [212.58.224.131]

Tracing route to zen.co.uk [82.71.140.243]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    <1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  192.168.0.1
  2    38 ms    38 ms    37 ms  gauss-dsl.zen.net.uk [62.3.82.18]
  3    38 ms    38 ms    38 ms  spinoza-ae0-160.hq.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.161]
  4    39 ms    38 ms    49 ms  bolzano-ae2-0.wh.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.53]
  5    40 ms    40 ms    39 ms  carneades-14-1-12.wh.zen.net.uk [62.3.83.100]
  6    44 ms    39 ms    38 ms  fw1.tc.net.hosting.zen.co.uk [82.71.206.251]
  7     *        *        *     Request timed out.
  8     *        *        *     Request timed out.

 

Tracing route to speedtester.bt.com [217.32.105.42]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    <1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  192.168.0.1
  2    45 ms    39 ms    40 ms  gauss-dsl.zen.net.uk [62.3.82.18]
  3    38 ms    39 ms    40 ms  spinoza-ae0-160.hq.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.161]
  4    39 ms    37 ms    41 ms  lotze-ae1-0.hq.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.66]
  5    38 ms    48 ms    40 ms  nietzsche-ae2-0.ls.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.70]
  6    41 ms    46 ms    41 ms  nozick-ae1-0.ls.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.74]
  7    46 ms    46 ms    46 ms  lorenz-so-0-1-0-0.te.zen.net.uk [62.3.80.78]
  8    49 ms    47 ms    49 ms  linx2.ukcore.bt.net [195.66.226.10]
  9    46 ms    46 ms    47 ms  core2-pos0-1-5-0.ilford.ukcore.bt.net [62.6.201.
121]
 10    46 ms    47 ms    47 ms  core2-pos9-0.stalbans.ukcore.bt.net [194.74.16.2
22]
 11    47 ms    48 ms    46 ms  vhsaccess2-gig1-0.stalbans.fixed.bt.net [217.32.
169.148]
 12     *        *        *     Request timed out.
 13     *        *        *     Request timed out.

Phil Long:

raf:

Mine seems to be back to normal now dozza, hope yours is too.

I spoke to support and they said some work was done on some of the routers this morning which might've been the cause.

It looks like your issue could have been due to interleaving - which was set to 'auto' and had switched on.  Opting out of interleaving should prevent a reoccurance.  :)

regards,

Phil. 

Hi Phil, it seems that was the case indeed. When we had some problems last Thursday interleaving was put on my line again automatically which led to more ping increases, I've now had it set from auto to off and my pings are rock solid again. :)